Going into year 3

[Husker99]

@Doc Holiday ... All I want from this year's team is a bowl game and hopefully a bowl win.

Just getting to a bowl game would be continued improvement--however incremental it might be.

 

[redfred]

@Doc Holiday ... All I want from this year's team is a bowl game and hopefully a bowl win.

Just getting to a bowl game would be continued improvement--however incremental it might be.

I can’t say that I’d be happy, but I’d probably be content.

 

[MRJFB]

We've lacked toughness for so long I've forgotten what it looks like. I hope you are right Doc Holiday but my cynical nature and the fact we hear this every year has me neither smiling or frowning.
There was this article, back in the 80s sometime, wish I could relay it. Was in the OWH. It's an essay. An out of state Husker fan gets a phone call from his dad in Lincoln. He tells him he thinks this might be the year, it's all coming together. You can tell by the way the players are talking. The numbers are in, bigger,faster, stronger. And the tight lipped Osborne, you can tell he knows he has something special etc.
The kid counters, Dad, you say this every year. And the players are 19 years old, they always talk like that. That they are focused, closer, understand the system. They say that every year. Anyway, it was a great article I've never forgotten. And by gravy, there were times it was dead on that way. But it's been a long, long time since this program didnt struggle to win games. Even under Bo, who produced good records but it was said of by Tom Shattel, Bo had wins you couldn't remember and losses you cant forget.
I cant say Bo's teams were necessarily tough but they were gritty if that makes sense.

 

[redfred]

I cant say Bo's teams were necessarily tough but they were gritty if that makes sense.

It does to me. For me gritty is tenacious, and tough means there is killer instinct that has been far to rare for several of NU's sports programs...…..including football.

 

[Doc Holiday]

I can testify that teams (to a certain degree) take on the demeanor of the staff they work under.
My biggest complaint about the Pelini coached teams was exactly as you say their "Grit"....they just seemed to never get in the right frame of mind for the big or really tough games and that translated into some of the worst losses in Husker History....ala Wisconsin in 2014....yes I know they had Gordon and Clement but they had to have a great line to play behind to get the numbers in total yards they did against us. To make matters worse Pelini was a DEFENSIVE COACH and failed badly to stop Wisconsin that night...now it's in Wisconsin's history books, not one of our finest moments for sure.
When his teams got punched in the mouth...instead of coming back and punching them in the throat so they couldn't catch their breath they acted timid or resolute that the game was already over.
The only teams I can truly say anything about is my teams under Coach Osborne....we always expected to get everyone we played, their best shot and it was built into us to hit back only we threw more punches that landed and we hit back harder than their best shot.
Coach always would tell us like at 1/2 time " Ok men we got their best shot and survived it just fine now let's go out there and give them ours and we can hit harder than they can so let's go now !" Just those simple direct words (because he had shown us he knew what he was talking about many times over) was enough to get us in the right frame of mind. I never saw that type of team in any of the post Solich era teams....I wasn't able to be around the Solich teams so I can't speak for them much but they were still made up of guys I played with but my guess is the culture started to change as the Osborne recruits graduated out of the team and then when Frank was fired and Callahan took over well we all know what happened under his watch now don't we......no sense in going thru that whole Callahan, Pelini, Riley scenario again now is there.
I can say however the toughness and size and grit we have been missing is slowly and steadily returning and it makes the little WOO-WOO hairs on the back of my neck stand up.

DOC HOLIDAY.

 

[Jimbosc]

Pelini's teams were gritty and tough minded - but also fragile - you could almost count on a let down as soon as Bo had a big melt down on the sideline. When you rule with fear - which I think Bo did - that can be tough minded to a limited extent when your opponent does not back down.

 

[Doc Fumble]

Pelini's teams were gritty and tough minded - but also fragile - you could almost count on a let down as soon as Bo had a big melt down on the sideline.

People typically point to our embarrassing meltdown against Wiscy in B1G Championship game in Indy, but the one that haunts me the most was the game we played against them in Camp Randall in a frickin' snow storm. We had them early and led 17 to 3 in the second quarter. But then Gordon got on a roll and you just knew that our gooses were cooked long before halftime.

IMHO, there's no worse feeling in the world than sitting through that kind of beat-down.

 

[Husker99]

We've lacked toughness for so long I've forgotten what it looks like. I hope you are right Doc Holiday but my cynical nature and the fact we hear this every year has me neither smiling or frowning.
There was this article, back in the 80s sometime, wish I could relay it. Was in the OWH. It's an essay. An out of state Husker fan gets a phone call from his dad in Lincoln. He tells him he thinks this might be the year, it's all coming together. You can tell by the way the players are talking. The numbers are in, bigger,faster, stronger. And the tight lipped Osborne, you can tell he knows he has something special etc.
The kid counters, Dad, you say this every year. And the players are 19 years old, they always talk like that. That they are focused, closer, understand the system. They say that every year. Anyway, it was a great article I've never forgotten. And by gravy, there were times it was dead on that way. But it's been a long, long time since this program didnt struggle to win games. Even under Bo, who produced good records but it was said of by Tom Shattel, Bo had wins you couldn't remember and losses you cant forget.
I cant say Bo's teams were necessarily tough but they were gritty if that makes sense.

It's difficult when to pinpoint when things decidely went south for Pelini. I think once Tom Osborne was forced out of the AD chair, I think that's when Bo said, "F it, I don't give a sh** anymore...." and started doing everything he could to get fired, but still get the contract money he was owed--which means not getting fired for cause.

I recently saw the (if memory serves) 2011 game against Michigan and the 2012 game against Ohio State and man, those Nebraska teams were tough, physical, and could run/hit with anyone.

And we haven't had a team even close to that since. I think we're getting back to that, but still have quite a ways to go. I have stated previously, and I stand by this, I still think even under Frost we're one, most likely two, full recrutiing classes away from having a team which reminds us of Huskers of old.

 

[valiantsailor]

We have not had a team that could play with anyone since we joined the B1G. However that said, RIleys teams could not out tuff a Pelini team at all. To be honest, Im not sure about a Frost team either. The last tough team we had in my memory is 1997.

 

[Huusker]

I think there was some physicality with Pelini's teams, but they often lacked mental toughness.

When adversity struck (as it does for all teams), or there was a bad call, Pelini would have a meltdown and the team took its cue from him. That Wisconsin game in the snow is a perfect example of this...there was also a South Carolina bowl game where play was even until the end of the first half, then they hit a Hail Mary pass for a TD as time expired. Game over. The second half was not too fun.

Frost's teams need to develop that "OK, you got us there, but we're still going to win" attitude. No one on the current team has played for a winner at this level, so it will have to be developed.

 

[Cigarman]

Pelini was a decent coach and a good motivator. However, he was an A-hole and could not recruit. When he ran out of Callahan talent he was in trouble.

 

[redfred]

Pelini was a decent coach and a good motivator. However, he was an A-hole and could not recruit. When he ran out of Callahan talent he was in trouble.

One change I'd make to the above is that instead of "could not recruit", I'd make it...…..would not recruit. He seemed to hate it.

I'd also add that when I had to chance to speak with him personally, I never saw the A-hole part that I saw in his demonstrations publicly. If you were to ask me what type of man he was after talking with him, I would have said....thoughtful and reserved. When the pressure was on, and in the heat of the moment, I didn't recognize the man I talked with.

 

[Husker99]

We have not had a team that could play with anyone since we joined the B1G. However that said, RIleys teams could not out tuff a Pelini team at all. To be honest, Im not sure about a Frost team either. The last tough team we had in my memory is 1997.

Then your memory is terrible. In a post in this thread I mentioned our 2011 game vs Michigan and the 2012 game against Ohio State. (Think I got the years correct.) Go back and watch those games, those were some tough teams, especially the game against Michigan.

 

[valiantsailor]

Then your memory is terrible. In a post in this thread I mentioned our 2011 game vs Michigan and the 2012 game against Ohio State. (Think I got the years correct.) Go back and watch those games, those were some tough teams, especially the game against Michigan.

Thats your opinion...am I not entitled to mine? By the way we got drilled 45-17. You call that tough?

 

[valiantsailor]

One change I'd make to the above is that instead of "could not recruit", I'd make it...…..would not recruit. He seemed to hate it.

I'd also add that when I had to chance to speak with him personally, I never saw the A-hole part that I saw in his demonstrations publicly. If you were to ask me what type of man he was after talking with him, I would have said....thoughtful and reserved. When the pressure was on, and in the heat of the moment, I didn't recognize the man I talked with.

Not to rehash Pelini but he should have credited the wins to the players and the losses to staff and coaches. He might have gone alittle further.

 

[bshirt]

Pelini was a decent coach and a good motivator. However, he was an A-hole and could not recruit. When he ran out of Callahan talent he was in trouble.

Oh boy, I've heard that exact same stuff at Rivals about 400,000 times. It's downright amazing.

Sure, Clownahan had so much talent he lost to almost everybody. His 4th year was arguably his worst year (yet another losing season).

Pelini was our next HC for seven years and won 9 or 10 games every single year. But he only won all those games because of Clownahan's (who was a losing machine) talent???? Incredible.....for seven years????

Wow......

 

[RED ED]

Not to rehash Pelini but he should have credited the wins to the players and the losses to staff and coaches. He might have gone alittle further.

and he should have gone after bigger LB's knowing the switch to the B1G was coming

 

[Husker99]

Thats your opinion...am I not entitled to mine? By the way we got drilled 45-17. You call that tough?

I'm talking about the game in 2011, and you're talking about the game 2018.

Sigh...why the F do I even bother.

 

[Cigarman]

Oh boy, I've heard that exact same stuff at Rivals about 400,000 times. It's downright amazing.

Sure, Clownahan had so much talent he lost to almost everybody. His 4th year was arguably his worst year (yet another losing season).

Pelini was our next HC for seven years and won 9 or 10 games every single year. But he only won all those games because of Clownahan's (who was a losing machine) talent???? Incredible.....for seven years????

Wow......

Wow is right. Maybe those 400,000 people are right and you are mistaken.

If you didn't notice the drop off in Pelini's teams after guys like Suh, Amukamara, Potter, Turner, Bowman, etc left, you weren't paying attention.

If you were paying attention, you would have noticed that the average ranking of Bo's recruiting classes were were 15 or 20 slots below Callagans.

If you were paying attention, you would have noticed Bo taking 4 or 5 QBs but only 1 or 2 O-linemen or D-linemen and zero LBs.

If you were paying attention, you would have noticed that nearly all the highest ranked players Bo signed left the team.

If you were paying attention, you would have noticed that Bo won zero championships. In fact, you could count all the ranked teams he beat on one hand and have fingers left over. Bo's record was built on beating patsies and his poor recruiting helped turn this team into one of those patsies.

 

[Crazyhole]

Wow is right. Maybe those 400,000 people are right and you are mistaken.

If you didn't notice the drop off in Pelini's teams after guys like Suh, Amukamara, Potter, Turner, Bowman, etc left, you weren't paying attention.

If you were paying attention, you would have noticed that the average ranking of Bo's recruiting classes were were 15 or 20 slots below Callagans.

If you were paying attention, you would have noticed Bo taking 4 or 5 QBs but only 1 or 2 O-linemen or D-linemen and zero LBs.

If you were paying attention, you would have noticed that nearly all the highest ranked players Bo signed left the team.

If you were paying attention, you would have noticed that Bo won zero championships. In fact, you could count all the ranked teams he beat on one hand and have fingers left over. Bo's record was built on beating patsies and his poor recruiting helped turn this team into one of those patsies.

Bowman didn't play under Bo. Beyond that, the schedules that Bo had were much more difficult than Callahan did and he still won at least 9 games every year regardless of who recruited the players. Of course we could also talk about the players that Callahan had to work with from Frank's recruiting, like Austin, Ross, Swift, Nunn, Christiansen, Grixby, Ruud, Williams, Washington, bullocks, bullocks, Herian, Adams, Carriker, and Smith.